Session #76: Ross Jeffries – Part Two

Disclaimer: Transcripts were generated automatically and may contain inaccuracies and errors.

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This is the Work Smart Hypnosis Podcast, session number 76, Ross Jeffries, part two. Welcome to the Work Smart Hypnosis Podcast with Jason Lynette, your professional resource for hypnosis training and outstanding business success. Here’s your host, Jason Lynette. Let’s begin with a story. A story from Aesop’s Fables titled The Lion and the Mouse.

A lion lay asleep in the forest. His great head resting on his paw. A timid little mouse came upon him unexpectedly and in her fright and haste to get away. Ran across the lion’s nose. Rased. From his nap, the lion laid his huge paw angrily on the tiny creature to kill her. Spare me, beg the poor mouse.

Please let me go, and someday I will surely repay you. The lion was much amused to think that a mouse could ever help him, but he was generous and finally let the mouse go. Some days later, while stalking his prey in the forest, the lion was caught in the toils of a hunter’s net, unable to free himself. He filled the forest with his angry roaring.

The mouse knew the voice, and quickly found the lion struggling in the net running to one of the great ropes that bound him. She nod at it until it parted, and soon the lion was free. You laughed when I said I would repay. You said the mouse. Now you see that even a mouse can help a lion. The moral of the story, a kindness is never wasted.

Hey, it’s Jason Lynette here, and to give you some of the back history, uh, there are legends of the recording that you are about to listen to. I would share that the story of this dates back to about February, 2016, at least in terms of the Work Smart Hypnosis podcast. Though the story could actually be round back to August, 2014.

I’m driving up to Marlboro, Massachusetts for the NG Convention and my phone rings and it’s a phone number from California. At least I recognize that, but I don’t recognize the. So I take the call and who’s on the other line, but someone that I would openly share, I had heard of. I had never purchased or participated with any of his training products, though the name was one that I knew.

And chances are you’ve known of him as well, Ross Jeffries, The the man who in many ways I would say dating back to the uh, uh, last 20, 30 years, kind of helped to pioneer a category that honestly is not. Cup of tea, not my focus, but the applications of hypnotic language patterns and NLP principles to the categories of all things pickup artists seduction.

Uh, I had heard legends of the, the Tom Cruise character in the, uh, Paul Thomas Anderson movie Magnolia, based on him. I could even think back to, I think, seeing him on the Daily Show many, many years ago in the talk show circuits. So, needless to say, like the story of the mouse and the lion, uh, person who I did not expect to get a phone call from, but the wonders of modern media and social media.

Turns out he’s a listener of the Work Smart Hypnosis Podcast. And if you go back to, I believe it’s session number 36, it’s a conversation that, uh, the first half of it I produced about a year and a half ago, session number 36 with Ross. And you hear in many ways how perhaps the character, the, uh, the personality has shifted, given some medical changes in his own life and things that he’s now more interested.

I mean, go back to that session. And it’s a surprising conversation as we’re talking about, uh, things such as trauma release therapy and hypnotherapeutic changes. So again, a conversation with a man whose reputation led me down a different path. Yet the conversation we then had was very different. Now why is this thing you’re about to listen to?

So interesting. Well, as the recording finished, suddenly the tables turned. And here was a man who had his own history behind him, had his own success behind him. Again, quite honestly, I just say it in a field of study that I just wasn’t too interested and then, and maybe had some strong opinions about as well, Suddenly sharing a passion towards his own learning.

Sharing a passion towards his own personal discoveries of his own healing. I mean, you’re gonna hear him in this conversation, really turn the tables. And really, he begins to interview me because he is looking for mechanisms for his own healing, as well as, uh, a brother going through cancer, a family member going through some emo emotional challenges.

So again, I felt the need to begin this, uh, this introduction here with the story out of AOPs Fables where you never know the conversation you’re about to have. So I’d share that. Uh, the, the only reason I’ve held this one back was, uh, because I lost the file. Uh, the wonders of recording. Most of these conversations that you listen to on the Work Smart Hypnosis podcast, uh, happened by way of a Skype record.

And, uh, I put the file in the wrong place. And, uh, as the saying would go, I hate to use the phrase of one from the Disney vaults, although this session will be marked explicit given the language. There’s nothing crude or offensive, we’ll call it conversational profanity. Uh, though you’re gonna hear a very different side of an individual that you might not have expected.

Uh, so I’m gonna let this thing stand on its own. We’re gonna cover all sorts of themes and topics in this discussion. We’re really, He’s drilling me on topics of hypnotic depth, the Dale State releasing emotional turmoil, uh, even the concepts of working with phone calls that would come in for things that perhaps you’re not quite qualified to address.

I mean, I share that, if you go back to that recording, there’s a moment where just by luck, we happen to be out on the West Coast at the same time, or at least out in Vegas at the same time. And it suddenly turned into a dinner, uh, having a conversation. And, uh, again, the person who I met was not the person who I expected because here were the stories of people who had signed up for his pickup artist style trainings and he’s refunding their money because he was seeing that as I would phrase it, there were things going on that he was not qualified to diagnose.

Even when other people were producing the event and they were getting paid here, he was handing the money back. So again, I love that story of the lion and the mouse because again, it’s that example where we don’t quite. Know what’s really behind some of the conversations, what’s behind some of the people.

So as you listen to this, I’d encourage you to set aside the history, set aside any preconceived notions, and really hear that person reaching out for their own healing, for their own passion, for their family members, as well as some ethical considerations of bringing in belief structures into our sessions, which might not be a fit for the person in the chair.

This thing’s about an hour long. Stick through it. This one’s probably not for everybody, though. I, I stand behind this one. This is, this is a keeper. Well, I can say that now that I actually found, found the file. So here we go. This is part two with Ross Jeffries. This has been great. Thanks so much. I really want to ask you a few questions.

Yeah, go for it. Um, as far as. Levels of trans. Some people say there are no such, there’s no such thing as level that tra is simply a state of mind where people are open to suggestion and can act on it. But then again, I’ve seen these videos of the Esda state. I’ve seen you do it where these people really are displaying some other level of dissociation or some other level of consciousness.

And I wanted to talk to you about this, that, that, in your experience, first of all, I’ve seen you do it. Do you believe that state is real? Uh, do you believe that state is more useful for working with clients? And if you do, what is it more useful for? My first sort of disclaimer on everything would be that recognizing that we’re, we’re talking about a different conversation, in my opinion, at least, uh, from what we’re talking about as practitioners to what the individual client’s experience may be.

So from the client perspective, depth being this measure of, let’s say, subjective ability. So whether that’s relaxation, whether that’s heaviness, whether it’s a light and floating sensation, whether it’s something euphoric, that I think to recognize that depth is gonna be different from one individual to another is gonna be at a very important thing to start to fold into that conversation.

From my side of things, as the practitioner, as the hypnotist working with somebody. I’d always look at depth in terms of just different scales of suggestibility. What’s gonna be possible within the process. There’s kind of a tongue and chic way of talking about it that I’ve been using these days, which again, I love the phrase that everything I’m about to say, I would argue to the death until presented with better information, uh, until other epiphanies would kick into gear that I would be comfortable saying to the question, what level of hypnosis do we need to produce change?

And to that, I’d comfortably say any level, uh, but I’d twist the words to then say that all levels of hypnosis may be created equal, though the twist is, again, some levels may be more equal than others. Yeah. All animals are created. Yeah. Yeah. got a Georgia, That’s not a good answer. It isn’t it a good answer at all, but it’s that perspective of putting the exterior on it, but then getting into it.

So yeah, as we talk about. As we talk in the different filters inside of it, we can’t just measure relaxation as being a filter of it. Because to look at something, a simple testing convincer moment of the hand is, arm is different, rigid, cannot be bent. Definitely a deeper state of hypnosis, but clearly not relaxation.

But to look at specifically, Yeah, go for it. Wait a minute, jump in then. Wait a minute, because I’ve seen this done. And the external muscles are relaxed, the biceps are relaxed, so it’s clearly some kind of skeletal muscle lock. Cause normally to hold your arm rigid, you have to use those external muscles, but those muscles are completely relaxed, yes or no, depending on the delivery of the epilepsy moment that in some of them it’s the, you cannot lower your arm in other variations.

It’s letting the muscles of your arm, all those muscles grow stiff and rigid as if they cannot bend, right? Yeah. So depending on the delivery, Is where I’d agree with that. But as you mentioned, the Esda state, do I believe such a thing exists? Yes. It’s that discovery that people were going there on their own.

Uh, even Esda did not have a technique to guide someone into Esda at the first phase of meeting with somebody. It was something that was conditioned over a series of sessions. And you, and I’ve talked on this before in the past as well, the anecdote that it wasn’t Dave Elman who pioneered the method to guide someone into Estel, it was his wife, um, that it was, there was Elman teaching these doctors.

At the time, their fear was the hypnotic coma, which in essence was the esda state, that people were not emerging from this process. That was as if they went somewhere that was so euphoric, so comfortable. They didn’t wanna emerge. No. So based on the idea that people were naturally going there, this thing was occurring, this is what was scaring some of the early vaudeville stage hypnotist out of the practice, is that people would go to this place where just something would happen and they just ignore the operator.

Yes. And it seems to me the claims are that in that state, the body heals. More quickly. Uh, the relaxation of infancy. I’ve heard it called it. And also you have anesthesia without suggestion. Right. Which I think would be fantastic to have that state in, in my back pocket. I really think it would. And also to, to heal from stress, to just go into that state for 20 minutes, an hour.

My brother has chronic pain as a result of leukemia. He doesn’t sleep even though he takes occasionally he will, and he’s in anything can hurt him. I would love to be able to put him in that state and let him stay there for an hour or two so his body can do some kind of healing. Uh, would you say it’s, would it, do you think it’s more accurate to say that that state is more useful for healing injury to the body and for, um, rest and recovery from surgery or from chronic conditions than say just, um, normal suggestion or quote, normal trance, whatever that means.

Yeah, I would combine it to say that it depends on our use. There’s always gonna be qualifiers here, so the actual physiological attributes of the state. If that’s all we did, yes, though I’d often bring that back to the same perspective of just talking about any sort of mind body, relax, ba, relaxation based therapy, that just to get the body into that state of calm, to get the body into that state of, let’s just paraphrase it as nothingness, that things will flow much more easily.

Um, you know, I’m working with two people right now that are currently going through chemotherapy and one of them I can get her into esda so easily. Um, the other, not so much. I’m sure over time perhaps she’ll be able to, It’s that same argument about someone being a natural ulus. Can we guide everybody into that state now?

Now, uh, hold on. Yes. Uh, for those you who don’t know, how do you define sinism? And for that, I’m gonna point to the test inside of a Dave Alman induction. Um, which again though, are we creating it or are we arriving at it by doing a test for amnesia? By suggestion, I’m gonna define it as levels of hypnosis where we can produce either amnesia or anesthesia and beyond.

So into the positive hallucination, into the negative hallucination, which the challenge is even with that, there’s always gonna be disclaimers in this conversation. Um, I’d reference the hairy Aarons Depth scale. It’s a good model. It’s not necessarily the only model, though. Can we produce positive and negative hallucinations, even in a conversational trance?

Yes, we can. Of course. So defining some NAB Bism, I’d point that as the person that we can achieve profound levels of amnesia and anesthesia inside of the hypnotic process. Okay, now let’s go back into this Dale State. Yes, I would think that someone who has physical pain or someone who’s about to undergo surgery, et cetera, cetera, that state would be a lot more useful for them than say a, a mere quote light trans or sy aism.

So wouldn’t you say it’d be useful for people to have that? I know, I would sure like to have that if I have to go through major surgery or, or I’m stressed outta my mind for something to have like an hour deep relaxation of infancy would sure be a great stress release, don’t you think? As opposed to, you know, whatever a level of trance is.

I’m trying to make a distinction about the usefulness of that state, cuz it really fascinates me. I saw this video, and I won’t mention who’s doing it, but he’s like putting clamps on the people and they’re not feeling anything and they’re out. I mean, they’re really out and they’re breathing this different.

I was playing around with this with some people and some were more susceptible, some weren’t, but you know, I did that test rubs clapping my hands right in front of their face. Nothing, nothing. I’d lift their arm, it’d flop, and then afterwards, , um, uh, people were saying, Do you remember he did that? She said no.

Mm-hmm , I think that state, why wouldn’t you if you had the ability teach all your clients to go there, just as something that would be so useful, I would love to have that state next time we meet. If you would like spend some time and get me there, I would be in your debt tremendously, cuz I think it would be very useful.

There’s a specific technique which perhaps is not directly meant to become Dale State, but I’d say dances so close to the border of that. It’s why I like the Jerry Kind light switch, self hypnosis process, that it’s one of drop the finger, everything shuts down, everything powers off, and it’s a process that’s pretty close to it in terms of conditioning it.

Um, but everything you’ve said is actually things I say to my clients about when I’m doing that process of getting to that place where just nothing matters. The body just completely profoundly relaxed. Nothing would move even if you were to try and just to kind of, to use my favorite word, just to kind of marinate in it, just to kind of just let the body be at rest, a state of mind, a state of body, without any tension whatsoever.

The, the side note here are the number of critics that for the Esda state. Would even go so far as to say that perhaps it’s not a state of hypnosis. Because one of the other characteristics you’ve mentioned, the the clapping, the distraction filters you’ve mentioned, the clamps, the anesthesia. Without suggestion though, one of the other characteristics becomes that the person ignores the operator, that they no longer are accepting suggestions.

In a true esda demo, there’s a moment where I’m gonna count from one to five and your eyes open up and you do that, and they just continue to go deeper on their own. That’s one of those true tests of the real demonstration to make sure you’re actually doing it as opposed to something that’s in the flavor of it.

So those critics would say again, that because of that, if hypnosis is about suggestion, then it’s no longer hypnosis to which I would disagree with that. Absolutely no sense, because you’re using suggestion as the vehicle to get them there. Bingo. Bingo. So guiding them that it’s, I think it’s nonsense. I think.

Thank you, . Yeah. Um, and let me turn back to, okay, so next time I see you, I want you to teach me this steak. Is I can surely use it. And also more importantly, um, I, I’d like to train my brother in it. He’s in horrible pain. My friend Sherry has chronic, um, she has lupus. So because of her lupus, she’s got chronic things going on.

And I would think that if she could get into the state, maybe an hour every day, at least many diseases as we know, dise or produce through stress, um, and toxicity. So, you know, if, if I could teach her that I think would be very helpful. And, uh, I think we actually live in a toxic world. To a large extent the way that this society is set up to worship money, to worship success, to being narcissistic, I think that’s toxic to the spirit, and this is one of the things I think that Posana circling back around can assist with.

But there’s something else I, I have had from time to time when people come to me and they want trans and or they ask what is hypnosis and blah, blah, blah, blah, and I wanna know if this is true because I think you’re more experienced doing this. You do it for a living. Sometimes I say to people, not only can people experience quote different levels of trans, but people have more natural abilities.

Some people are able to do positive hallucination better than say pain control. Some people can do pseudo orientation in time better than any of those other things. Have you found that some clients have different. Have easier access to different levels of ability. I’d agree with that. My filter tends to be, and there’s so much work that’s out there by, by people that I highly respect about classifying clients.

It’s, it’s a bit of an update on this whole, Oh, this type of person is analytical. I, I don’t buy in any of that, but there’s some work out there in terms of people from this region at this specific age with this specific style of career may be a better client. I, I’d reference as someone who. Sits downs with clients nearly every day of the week.

Everything that I do filters through several presuppositions that you’re coming in, you’re ready for this process, and you’re gonna go to the most optimal level that I need to work with you to help you to produce this change. So I’m not going into any session ever with this perception that this one’s gonna be more difficult, this one’s gonna be easier.

Um, you’d probably agree this whole conversation about resistant clients, Ha, , thank you. I can tell by the laugh, the whole conversation of resistant clients very often is lack of rapport, lack of an understanding, lack of demonstration of knowledge, lack of everything that should be there. I I, I don’t say this to brag, but I just don’t run into resistant clients because I refuse to create them.

Is there resistance to change? Yeah, of course there is. Otherwise, they wouldn’t be in the office that day, otherwise they would’ve produced the change already on their own. So that’s the only resistance I’m going to accept. Are there some people out there that, as we’re talking about hypnosis and trans or any of this, that may have some preconceived notions?

Well, of course, but our process, it’s sales 1 0 1, satisfy objections before they can even arise. So thank you for the laugh. That tells me everything I need to say. So I’m going into every session with this perception that this person is ready and they’re gonna go right where they need to go. But are there people that are gonna be much more, let’s say, natural at it?

I’d say absolutely that I’m gonna have some that, um, I’d have some that I’d say any sort of hypnotic induction, any sort of ritual to go into the process may actually have just been a courtesy. That I did it because we should do it. And that’s what we normally do there. And even with those, the more that I work with people, you know, I, I’d be, there’s different physiological signs of the process, different things we look for, and there’d be moments where I’d be a minute into the work and I’d just, by nature of the process, even it works as a deepener just to say, Okay, great, you’re already there.

And we just jump into the content. We actually work through the process at that point. So are there some that are just more naturally able to do it? Yes. Uh, though the answer is, I’m gonna take whatever levels I can get and use the appropriate modalities, the appropriate response in that moment, given whatever I have in front of.

All right. Uh, and here’s a more personal question. I have days where I’m having a really, really shitty day. Uh, something is gone in my personal life that really has me upset or had trouble sleeping. How do you, I’m sure you have days like that where you still have to, um, bring it up and getting in the office and be ready to work.

What do you do personally when you have those kind of days where you’re really just feeling shitty that you’ve gotta bring it? And if you don’t mind me asking, it’s a personal thing. Absolutely. It’s something that I realized early on I had to work on. It was something that early on, and especially think of the demands of, um, opening up a business, you know, paying for a, paying for bills.

Uh, I have a family. So, and, and the other flip side of this too, before I even share the, the way that I’ve done it, Is something to be said about, um, the client can pick up on that in any sort of conversation, if, especially anything of a sales nature. They can tell just through the energy of the conversation, the words being said, and the intention of everything.

If you’re really, really hungry and you need that person to convert. So this dips into the business side too, I’d say, because it becomes, how do I get in that right mental state? And oddly enough, if you weren’t talking about something that I just spent a whole two hours on this past Sunday, so it’s all fresh.

I’d say it from this perspective. First, I meet people at hypnosis conventions, and I’ve gotta say it here. The number of workshops that I see offered at con, at conventions that are all about, uh, preventing issues of transference, preventing, uh, you know, how to not be worn down. The people I meet who basically would say, Oh, I only can handle like one or two clients a day because they bring in their problems.

And that just wears me down to which my first response may be a little harsh to some ears, but it tells me right away you don’t understand the focus of this process. I am always associating with my client as they walk in the door with their result. If I’m not willing to go first, if I’m not willing to see them as the result.

And then the phrase says, Bring ’em along for the ride. We’re both gonna stay in the problem state. Well, it’s the difference between willingness and capability. You may be willing, but you’re so, uh, jumbled by whatever’s going on. You just can’t do it. I, I speak as a, you know, as a confession, when I went through those two years of insomnia, it was excruciatingly difficult to put on these seminars where four, while I’m dealing with something different, I’m dealing with like 40 guys of which 25 of them are severely emotionally damaged and they’re literally drain, They’re sucking off me and looking at me with these puppy eyes.

It’s one of the reasons why I stepped aside from doing it. Cause it’s just so, so difficult on top if you’re healthy, but then, you know, having insomnia made it, uh, a health issue. I just couldn’t get to it. But yes, she may be willing, but what is your method to get. Mine was actually, I did a little bit of work on myself, and there’s a phrase that has worked its way into my process with clients that I’m admitting is probably there for me just as much for them.

Um, so the first phase of it is the mindset that I’m seeing them as the result and then getting there as fast as I can. The other is this little phrase of as you walk out that door and just building everything I could inside of myself that the threshold here of my office doorframe as I walk out, as I walk in, it’s a clean slate.

Uh, admittedly, if I have a personal phone call, I leave my office and I hang out in the lobby and I make that call there. So that s spatial awareness, that bit of work I’ve done on myself, that as I walk out the door of working with a client and I greet the next one, I, I’m fresh with the new one. And this is something admittedly I did work on for quite some time and.

Uh, I would even comfortably say continue to work on it and it must be working because I can have a day where I, I’ve changed my schedule in recent years when I, when I didn’t have kids, I’d do the marathon seven or eight client day, where I’d be here a good 12 hours these days. Balancing family balancing, session, balancing other things that I do rather than sit other than sit with clients.

So I’m seeing a lighter load these days. I’ve gone from like seven or eight a day down to about four or five a day. But even with this pro principle in mind, I’d walk out with as much energy as I walked in with. Are there moments where I have to be aware of things? Yeah, I can actually reference, um, Something that I’ll talk about here.

I had this weird dry cough pop up couple of years ago, um, that all sorts of medical scans, all sorts of anything, just weren’t finding anything. And admittedly, I had a client who, um, anyone who knows me personally can remember when that was there. It’s completely gone now. But I had a client who called up with the exact same issue and the thought on that one was, Okay, I’m listening to the rationalizations as to why they think this is there for them.

And I’m also playing the rationalizations in my mind in terms of why I thought mine was there, which I love the line of when you’ve got the rationalization. So accept a 50 50 chance of being wrong. But that was one that admittedly I responded. Say that again, , when you have that unconscious, that is a gorgeous idea.

Say it again and admittedly, I first heard Roy Hunter say that when you have that. Conscious rationalization as to why an issue exists. You still have to admit at least a 50 50 chance of being wrong. . I love that line. I heard him say that when I brought him into town a couple of years ago. So I mean, I’d referenced the client who would come in that I have this fear because, Well, which part of the mind is telling them that?

Do you know who Emo Phillips is? The comedian? Yeah. He had a great line about, I used to think that the brain was the most intelligent organ in the entire body. Then I realized who was telling me that. Okay, well this gets back, this gets back to the tre work where, where they’re talking about, uh, a lot of stuff is actually stored in the gut and in the muscle patterns.

That, that the body itself has its own intelligence, and the body knows how to naturally correct these things. If we give it a little bit of nudge, uh, I really want you to look into this stuff and perhaps I’ll try that. Find it utterly fascinating. You’re, you’re an interesting dude to talk to. You. Notice how this is turned into, like me interviewing you.

Here’s one for Yep. Uh, if I tell people I do hypnosis, they go, Oh, I’m not gonna look into your eyes, . And my answer doesn’t. My answer is totally stolen from Richard Bando. I said, It doesn’t go in those holes, wrong holes, , and you’re gonna make me, you’re gonna make me do things I don’t wanna do. I said, Well, that would be called alcohol, uh, or a gun, assuming.

That you do tell people what you do say in a cocktail. You don’t go to cocktail parties. You got a wife and kids. But assuming you know, you’re in some casual conversation and people ask, What do you do? And you say, Well, I’m a hypnotist, or I do hypnotherapy. How do you answer those, those questions like, Oh my God, are you gonna make me quack like a duck?

Or, or, um, oh, it’s, I’m not gonna look into your eyes. I would imagine that that’s a, a large percentage of the answers and some of them that I get is, Wow, that’s really fascinating. Oh, yeah, it really helped me. But how do you answer the really, I shouldn’t say dumb. That’s a, if I didn’t know about it. Well, ignorant isn’t a negative word if we really look at it.

Yeah. Um, let me follow my classic pattern and answer everything you didn’t ask by the, and then answer what you did ask, uh, which would be that, and this popped up in a recent class that I’ve got going on. I, I think the biggest flaw for hypnotist when they encounter that type of moment isn’t necessarily what the other person is saying.

It’s really the bigger issue that somewhere inside of that hypnotist, they’re agreeing with that person. So this is why you’d see people, in my opinion, that hide from the word hypnosis. Now, I may be biased here because my business’ name is Virginia Hypnosis, and it was built upon the premise that people in Virginia are looking for hypnosis.

And sure enough they are. And um, yes, it cost money to run a business, but I’ve got a $0 advertising budget these days. The systems are just running themselves. I’d like to talk to you about that too. Uh, yeah, let’s come back to that as an entrepreneur. We’ll get to that. Yeah. So as we look at, um, How does the person respond?

It kind of goes back to, well, it’s actually an entrepreneurial answer in terms of how I initially built my business. I was doing a chamber of commerce, I was doing network marketing, and the premise that I had was, was my job. Wait, wait, wait. Let’s, um, yeah. When you say you were doing network marketing, you were selling Amway, what does that mean?

You No, no, no. That’s, that’s multi-level marketing. Network marketing would be like the Chamber of Commerce, the BNI Business Networking International. Yeah, your networking. That’s something, Yeah. You may run into those mlm, uh, Amway, Arban, all these other products that are out there. You may run into those people there and to dismiss them as a huge flaw, because for the most part, I found these people are amazing connectors.

So I’d be in this environment where it would be, let’s use the Chamber of Commerce example. It would be me there. With lawyers, with real estate agents, with business owners, with politicians at these events, and my thought was they take everything that they do and stand for very seriously. Therefore, it’s my responsibility to the same with what I believe in.

So that’s why I use that phrase that the bigger flaw would be that people sometimes are agreeing with them and that’s where, again, they’re going into that other person estate. I, I found that. Answering whatever questions with authority and with confidence. And for the most part too, and I, I hesitate this phrase, but not necessarily looking the part of what they’d expect.

They’re expecting woo woo, they’re expecting weird. And I’m there dressed professionally. I’m there communicating, putting words together in full sentences. I’m just speaking with authority and confidence. I think this might be a bism as well, um, of whatever issues may be there reframing it. It’s already being a hypnotic state.

So I, I’ve never liked the twist to say, and I’ll use the example of, you know, we define hypnosis as being that bypassing of the critical factors of the mind. So I paraphrase that to mean automatic response in spite of conscious awareness. So the easiest examples, the ones we all probably have used before, you’re driving your car thinking of everything other than driving.

And you still end up at home, you’re watching a movie and you know everything up there is fiction and yet you get, still get swept up in the story or, and let’s make it personal here, there you are on that airplane and you know that statistically speaking, you’re safer up there than you were driving to the airport and yet you’re terrified there you are smoking two packs a day when you know you’d like to be a non-smoker.

There you are eating in response to this feeling that, you know, for a fact is not even hunger. Whatever way I can paraphrase whatever they’re going through, through that definition, which kind of ends with a polite yet sort of a joke of, well, congratulations, you’re already doing hypnosis. I’m gonna show you how to do it better.

And how did you evolve this, this explanation? Obviously trial and error, which I think is a big part of, um, yeah, w trial and error is the benefit of that network marketing environment. Think of the comedian getting up and testing out new material, the stuff you see the guy on HBO doing for an hour. He didn’t just write that and get up there.

Um, there’s a great, great documentary. I know I’m taking a comedy writing class. Oh, cool. Just, just a standup class. Yeah. There’s an amazing documentary, um, of Jerry Seinfeld called Comedian, and if you can find this, I don’t think it’s on any streaming, you’ve gotta find a used DVD copy of it in my experience.

But it’s kind of cool to watch him struggling to come up with a brand new hour of material. Yeah. So I love that metaphor because the, the environment of, I’m in an area with several big cities in close proximity, so I crash and burn at the Arlington Chamber of Commerce. Okay. Springfield, Virginia is tomorrow.

So it’s that trial and error to find the right way of doing read? No, I network marketing for me cuz I still think of it as multi-level. What does that mean? People come together, uh, on the subject of marketing, what does it mean? It’s local business owners meeting together for the purposes of growing each other’s business.

Okay. So they’re It’s networking. I it’s networking. It’s networking. No, I’d referenced too. The other bit is, um, and I think I shared this with you and it’s actually the very first session of this podcast was taking the classic hypnosis pre-talk, which was all very negative language. People have this fear, here’s what’s gonna happen.

Instead people have this fear, here’s what’s gonna happen instead in flipping that all around. So in my pre-talk, I’m talking explicitly about what is going to happen rather than what’s not going to happen. So that combination of talking it about the process really as it is the, the other bit that I share, and I think it just came from.

I, I’d phrase it this way, uh, when I do stage hypnosis, which is how I got into all of this, I, I have a series of things I just called power statements, statements I could make that would get the audience completely silent, which would be in a good way for high school. They’re excited, they’re talking, they’re making noise.

And there’s parts of the program where I’d want absolute focus on something and the statement of, I’m here to give you the best show I can give you, but I can’t do that if you all don’t be the best audience you could be. I got it. Positioning something with authority, which was the phrase of, I’ve heard of some corporate entertainers going, Well, folks, I’ve already been paid today.

Oh God. So it’s up to all of us to decide what type of event we’re about to have. Jesus, we can struggle. I hate that, but Jesus hates Christ. Exactly. I’m enjoying this. I hope you don’t mind if we continue to go on and Oh yeah, absolutely. So I, I’d reference too that. Talking about the process is what it is, and I’d even go so far as to make adjustments.

I think it’s something that, you know, we can talk about someone who’s qualified to make a decision and whether it’s a relationship, whether it’s a purchase, whether it’s an interaction. But I would say that even for people out there that feel, they have an idea as to what the process is, the quote lay public that are not hypnotists, that anything we can do to further educate and update their knowledge.

So I’d even jump on the phrase when someone says, Oh, I’m a big believer in this stuff, that this may be bending some research in our favor. But the phrase of, Well, when you look at the amount of research that’s out there, when you look at the neuroscience of the mind and what we now understand and what research now suggests, you’d start to see that belief is actually a concept that’s maybe about 30, 40 years out of date.

That we have better knowledge now. We’re not quite in the category of, well, I think the Easter Bunny, I think the tooth fairy does come and visit. We have better knowledge now. Of course, the research is constantly growing. Unpack that. This, you know what, I have to interview you for my students Un and cuz my students are interested in improvement in general.

But in any case, un unpack what you just said. Where you said about beliefs that we’re doing new research in, into beliefs. Cuz I did that concept maybe cuz uh, um, I’m a little down on sleep. I didn’t quite get that. So I’m not up to my usual intellect. Okay. Yeah. When you look at, um, just my favorite resource for this was just to hop on Google’s scholar.

and there are so many research studies that have been done and so many new ones that are being formed. Actually, uh, I just got some interesting results back. I haven’t read them yet. Sorry, Greg. Uh, but Greg Posik, who was on this podcast program, um, couple of months back, they’re doing some amazing work with research on hypnosis up at University of Chicago or for you over at University of Chicago of.

Updating a more interactive style of hypnosis rather than the older styles. So to point out this specific study, I mean, any of them, this specific study found this percentage of success by using hypnosis to achieve this result. Um, to type in anything in there, type in, um, well you’ve brought it up to type in hypnosis and insomnia, and you have clinical trials, clinical studies that are backing up the efficacy of it.

You look at, um, woman who’s on the, uh, program a couple of weeks back, Seth, Deborah Roth, a nurse, the amount of work that she’s done with IBS and hypnosis and a lot of research pointing to. Between acupuncture and hypnosis, No other modality out there having as high of a success rate with the process than what we’ve been talking about so far.

I suggest you begin to look at Tre Oh, absolutely. Widen the options and I mean, I, I have the answer to my students, my hypnosis students who would ask about, Well, what about this? What about that? I. The greatest flaw of any training out there is the, um, let’s get biblical thou shall have no other gods before me.

Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, yeah. To, to get into this mindset that this is the one way to do it. And if you’re not doing it this way, you’re not gonna get results. I’ve seen those schools of thoughts even have a student ask, Well, what about metaphors for this? And they say, No, just use this process. Yeah, I run from that.

That’s, Yeah. That’s a, that’s a preacher, not a teacher. Did I, Did I give you my, did I give you my statement on absolutes before? Uh, I absolutely never use absolutes. . Oh, yours is better than mine. Every time you hear someone speaking in absolutes, assume they’re an idiot and realize that was an absolute, I like yours better.

Plus it uses normalization a thing. Call an idiot. Um, , uh, here’s something I think is very fascinating and this is, uh, the normalization. The placebo effect cuz no one can explain how the placebo effect works. And, uh, interesting. Um, I have a full head of hair, but somehow I was looking at Rogan, I was looking at it and at 3% of the people who take Rogan grow hair, , Rogan, Wait, I’m gonna type it in placebo.

No. And I’d say that was someone who’s been thinning a little on top and used it. And actually based on the bragging rights on the bottle, I stopped using it. Here it is. Here it is. I’m just looking about it here. Uh, on the website it said, um, certain people can actually think their way into stopping hair loss and regrowing hair.

Clinical trials with 2000 subjects. Um, blah, blah, blah. 2% basically that the average study subject who was taking a placebo not only stopped losing hair but grew a small amount of hair and they didn’t even know they were using. Whether they were, what they were using is the real deal or the placebo , which I think is hilarious.

Absolutely hilarious. And someone with your experience, how the hell would you explain that? Well, I mean, to, to credit and maybe even discredit a product that I now have about four bottle oh, two bottles. I went through two of them and just eventually went, Yeah, it’s good enough. And I, I, I point out that FDA approved.

Is kind of a misnomer, I’d say in our current society. It doesn’t mean successful, it just means that they’ve approved that it’s not gonna kill somebody . So, um, there’s an am Oh, you can find this online. It’s amazing. And it, it came about, I’ll put this in the show notes cuz it’s a funny little thing and I, and I point this thing out not to rip apart these products, but it’s interesting because someone did something funny.

It, it’s kind of sad, but just goes with the times that one in the airplane, Sky Mall has gone bankrupt and they’re gonna stop producing those. So I’d almost bet you that, um, I though I’d almost bet you it’s gonna be like there still is a Circuit city.com. Someone bought the name rights and it’s now an online reell.

I’m heartbroken that Radio Shack is going outta business. Yeah. So same thing. The name isn’t gonna go away, but it’s gonna change what it is. Yeah. Um, so, but someone for a while back before, you know, we had all these more fun things to play with. Let’s phrase it that way. On an airplane, he’d take a sharpie on his flight and he’d just go through the Sky Mo and add commentary and he’s pointing about, um, buzzword science term that means nothing FDA approved means nothing of efficacy, only means it won’t kill people.

And it was his way of basically going through the entire Sky Mall and reframing all these claims that were in. and pointing out that they weren’t actually making any statements. So how do these things get approved? Well, it’s even the phrase that they’re pointing, the, the buzz one was EIA that they were pointing to in a recent study.

That, and I’ll put this one too once I find it, um, that a number of the herbal supplements didn’t actually include the herbal supplement that was on the bottle . So efficacy aside, how are these things getting approved? Well, the state of things right now is, well, it’s in some way are free market that do they have to be approved, that this thing isn’t gonna kill somebody.

Um, at this point kind of really, when you look at some of the research on it. Um, but how is it that the placebo response is getting it? Uh, I’d always wanna look at the opposite first, which is that I’d say no sibo. You know, getting the, getting no reaction from something that is successful is often a bigger phenomenon than actually placebo of the person who is actually taking something that is, and the hypnotist out there would appreciate this when you do everything right and your process, but the client isn’t doing it.

the, the perspective of something that is effective in making it less effective. I, I don’t know. I don’t have a straightforward answer in terms of, You know why it is that this is possible. I have a theory which is just ties back into Ernie Rossi who’s really into, um, gene expression. Uh, if someone believes strongly enough something happens between the, um, parts of the brain and the hippocampus or whatever it is, it triggers the gene gene expression for growing hair.

That’s what I think, but the exact. Down to the molecular structure and all of that. We, we now are finally beginning to get the tools to scientifically answer these questions. I think this is a, in the whole idea of science, this is very interesting to me. I’m gonna make some curly cues here because you’re a brilliant man and you stimulate my intelligence.

So is that causing any hair growth? No. , No. I have to tell you, you’re a very likable guy. When I met you in Vegas, I went, this is a good dude. I wanna become friends with him. Now you are in Virginia. Yes. I’m assuming that in Virginia you are not required to be a licensed psychotherapist or clinical social worker or anything like that, that there’s no actual licensing or testing procedure to be a quote hypnotherapist.

Is that incorrect or correct? Well, that’s correct for Virginia, but that’s also correct for pretty much every state. That only a few states have. Uh, there was an experiment at one point in Indiana where there was a licensing program, um, and that it was quickly taken down because I may be paraphrasing here, but the way the story’s been explained to me is a licensing was formed in Indiana, but it basically by accident created a monopoly that to be licensed, you had to go through this one school.

And I may have the slight details off, and I know that, for example, Washington State has a registration program. Colorado has a registration program, which they have it here in California, which really disturbs me in terms of the quality. You know, you take a six months course with, um, the motivational trans college.

That’s what I’ll call it. Because I don’t want anyone to get sued. And they’ll basically, as far as I can tell, I don’t know this to be the case, but I’ve seen people who are complete idiots and they have their certificate, they put out a shingle and, and they’re doing trance. And I find this disturbing because some people, I found people that I can’t help.

They come to me and they have some serious personality disorders. They’re narcissistic, or I, I believe these categories are not literally true, but they do describe fairly accurately a cluster of traits. Um, they’re narcissistic or they’ve been, uh, they are, um, borderline personality, whatever you want to call that.

And I think this is dangerous to work with unless you’re, uh, got some serious training in, in some kind of school of psychotherapy. So there are some people I say I can’t help. Not, I do the same thing all the time, not because, And so how do you make that, I’m loving this. You’re, I have to, This is turning into me interviewing you, which I don’t know if that’s ever happened before on one of your podcasts.

No, this is the first. I’m loving it too. No, I’d say that for the person. I, I’d politely use the phrase of, there’s something going on that I’m not qualified to diagnose, and how do you make that judgment? And I don’t have a set criteria that I’m consciously aware of in terms of how I do that. Uh, I’m, I’m listening for my process.

I’m always looking for the context of the issue. I’m, this is perhaps part of the same reason as to how I’m able to go through the day with so many people at a time and, and not take on a challenge. I’m connecting with the context rather than the content of the story, the stories, the representation, the stories, the events, but instead the context.

How do you feel now? How would you rather feel? What are those things you’re doing now? What are those things you’d rather be doing? And that’s, that’s what I’m looking for. So, As I’m asking the questions to find those outcomes, it’s usually, in most cases, where I’m seeing sort of the, the chink in the armor of what’s, what needs to be there, that it’s a match for me to work with you.

Um, I’m looking for an ownership of the problem too. So I’d reference, um, this is why now I’ve got a strict policy on something that if it’s an adult client, they have to be the one to call. Before the process even begins, and I, I’m very respectful and I’m polite on the phone, but an example a few days ago of a woman calling on behalf of her son, the details of what the issue are secondary, but I can just politely ask the question.

Okay, well he’s 24. Why are you calling rather than him? And I’ve only ever had one answer to that over the years that actually I thought was worthwhile is actually a gentleman who was uh, over in Afghanistan. His sister was a psychologist, He wanted to quit smoking. He knew that she had some awareness of hypnosis to which she goes, I didn’t really have sufficient training in this.

Let me find someone for you. And his goal was to arrive. He was arriving Tuesday back in the States. He wanted to see me Wednesday. So for that one situation, she did all the research. Yeah, send him on in. And he was phenomenal. But in most cases, you know, it’s that outer perspective of my husband’s cheating and I want you to work with him.

It’s gotta be his intention. Otherwise, well, again, I don’t think that’s a problem that’s susceptible to hypnotherapy that, see, I would go, you know, that’s family dynamics. I, you can’t sanitize someone with that kind of problem. It’s not, uh, do you understand what I’m saying? Like what, Well, I, I would say you can, if he is calling and saying, I’m having these urges, I’m having these challenge, it, it’s that controversial question of, uh, would you work with someone for pedophilia?

Uh, would you work with someone who is actively saying, This is what I’ve been doing, and I don’t wanna be this way. You can’t do that because you have a requirement to report crime. Exactly. So you can’t do that. But, no, let, let’s get back to that. If people are of a family systems issue, it’s not about, you have to look at the entire family.

You have to bring people. Now you’re in the realm of doing psychotherapy. I, I, I certainly personally would, would not do something like, So I’d point out that, um, and this is something that the NG introduced a while ago of their line, that our, our process is helping normal everyday people with normal everyday problems.

But I would comfortably point out, that’s not everything that calls in though I’d actually, I’d reference even as early as yesterday. Um, I spent some time yesterday for about an hour or two returning some calls, and there was one specifically that I’ll generalize here. There’s one specifically that, uh, I was hearing all the details of the story.

I’m asking, what would you like to happen? And I’m just hearing, you know what? Unfortunately, I don’t think that my service is a match for you, and I wish I had a resource for you. Now, my style is, I always wanna leave it on a positive note, so understand I’m looking for one. So as you find someone who can help you out with that, please give me a call back afterwards and let me know who they are.

I’d love to meet them. Great. Great. So I, I wanna leave the conversation on a positive note rather than, Wow, that’s screwed up. I can’t fix that. Uh, and sometimes I do have a resource. Um, I had someone see, I, I’d vary from others that I’ll work with someone for issues around grief and regret if it’s been several years and the issues are still there.

But a few months back I got the call from someone that had just recently lost the spouse as of like a week or two before. And for that, when I’m going, Well, you know what? I could probably work with you on that, but I’d rather refer you to a friend of mine who actually is a specialist in this area. It’s actually a local psychologist, and this is what her main focus is.

You can hypnotize people out of a natural, healthy process. Yeah. I’d want them to actually go through that natural cycle as as natural as it can become. Uh, so the phrase of, let me go through it faster, I didn’t feel comfortable with that. So I made the referral and I’ve heard great feedback already. And this is again, kind of bringing everything full circle.

This has been that benefit of just being a part of my local community. Is that I meet these people, I make these connections, and it’s great to be able to tell somebody, Yeah, I, I’d phrase it this way, it’s, I crack a joke about weight loss. That on the side of things, of strategies and behaviors, the emotional stuff we’ll get to later, but the segment of working with eat this food more, do this activity more, just the nuts and bolts of the issue.

I, I’d crack the joke that by the time someone calls the hypnotist, you can realize for the most part, you probably already have an expert in front of you. They know those things they should be doing, but I can count two times where I had someone in front of me who clearly didn’t have an idea about nutrition, about exercise, and for that, again, I didn’t want to ever criticize that person.

So it became, okay, so great. Now that we’ve got that consult out of the way for today, let me connect you with a, uh, team of, uh, nutritionists that I know. Find one you like, work with them, and then come back. That’s when we’ll start the process and I’ll help reinforce it. So I wanted to treat this moment as if that’s how we always do it, rather than, Wow, you don’t know what you’re doing.

So I wanna leave every encounter in a more positive way. But back to your question, I, I don’t accept every client that comes in. I mean, the, the biggest example was the guy who called up one time, and I’ll change names here, of course, of, um, real name is Dick . Well, his name is, uh, Ross J. Now that’s a little too obvious.

It’s our Jeffries. Let’s go Now, , uh, a guy who calls up one time and says, Well, I’ve been having these voices in my head for quite some time now. They’re getting kind of angry and violent. Can you help me with that? No. And I didn’t want to give him a no and send him in the wrong direction. And I didn’t want to make the issue worse by denying, but I definitely didn’t want to accept him as a client.

So my phrasing was, I think I can, However, I think a friend of mine would be a better fit. His name is Bill, Do you want his phone number now? Again, I’m changing the name. I didn’t tell him that it was Essent. Essentially you fobbed the problem off of it to somebody. Yeah, I, The guys, the guys that been a helper.

You go, you take care of the schmuck. I, I don’t wanna deal with him. Let, Well, actually, in this case, this one’s a funny story cuz again, it’s a made up name, but I didn’t tell him that. My friend Bill was Dr. Bill Johnson, who was a local psychiatrist whose specialty is, Uh, dissociative personality, so made that connection and I eventually got a thank you call from the client, which the anecdote is first of all, he called me a son of a bitch, a smart ass son of a bitch, because he goes, If you told me you were referring me to a doctor, I would’ve never called that guy, but he said, My friend Bill.

That brings up an interesting question. Do you think that there are ever any circumstances in which psychiatric medication can be useful for people at least temporarily? Or are you someone who’s like absolutely against? I’m someone who’s for it. I’m someone who’s looking at the benefit of something.

There was a fun moment in a class back in September where the argument rose that all these medications are bad. There’s another, uh, absolute. And all these, uh, diagnoses are, um, over, all these things are over diagnosed, to which I just had, They asked the question of, would you agree though that there’s people out there that perhaps these medications would save their life?

Yes. And for those that are overdiagnosed, would you argue the other side as well, that perhaps in some cases they’re underdiagnosed? So I, I’d wanna follow that kind of evolutionary mindset that, Well, let’s go back to the Rogan. Is it a match for every single person? Perhaps not. Does it work for some of the people?

Some of the time, yes. And you get a little sick. We don’t do a blood letting anymore cuz we found out as a society that doesn’t work. . So from that evolutionary standpoint, I mean, this is how. I actually have several clients right now that are medical doctors. Um, I have several referral sources that are medical doctors from a business perspective, if I got into this us versus them, that doesn’t help us advance hypnotism and LP or any of this, but from a more practical, just real world example.

These things are either discovered or invented or formulated or whatever process they use and eventually tested and released because they serve a purpose. Um, I, I’d comfortably share the story that, um, when you and I first met, I was out in Vegas and I was teaching at the Hypno birthing convention, and that was a group that, to bring up the concept of the epidural is something that’s definitely not part of their natural childbirth process.

But again, are there people out there that, first of all, epidural is not only used for childbirth, uh, it’s used for all sorts of medical procedures. Are there people out there that perhaps wouldn’t be alive because of this, because of this medical intervention? Are there babies who wouldn’t be in this world because that was what they deemed at the time, the most appropriate way to go into the delivery process?

Absolutely. So the technique is neither good nor bad. So are there instances where things are maybe a little prescribed? Yes, but at the same time, I bet they’re also being under prescribed in certain environments. So I, I think we need to find a better quality of balance. Um, I, I don’t have the research to back up the statement that some would argue that some of these things were invented to be more of a brief intervention as opposed to a long term treatment.

I don’t have the research to back that up, but it, it’s a phrase that’s often thrown around as well. Um, let me ask you one more final question, then. Uh, I’m gonna let you go, or you’re gonna let me go. . Uh, I love how this process is reversed. I see some, to me are very questionable things like past life regression and, uh, you could say, Well, if the client believes in it, it’s useful, But I think you’re really getting to the realm of some very, uh, I won’t mention names, but you sent me to someone.

I was, you know, quite put off that there’s this problem coming from the past life or before this person’s soul entered the body. I kept telling him, I don’t believe in this stuff. I, he said, Well, we need to negotiate terms that, that, uh, no, doesn’t work for me. Hmm. I, I think this gets in, I think, you know, people can become quote so suggestible, it gets into the realm of fantasy, and then people do it for entertainment.

I, I don’t like the whole idea of, of people doing this. Uh, so I know no one can prove it. But I’m gonna ask you, in your opinion, I, and I don’t want to hear the answer, if it’s useful for clients, it doesn’t matter. I wanna hear your actual statement on what you think is factually going on. All right. So I’m not gonna let you slip, Slide your way out of this.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I. I’ll give you, I’ll give you two sides cuz this is a common question for me. Uh, option number one would be that the acceptance of, um, and again, I don’t have specific numbers on this, but it’s actually been said that the majority of people in this world, actually that’s part of their belief system and perhaps that we can look at the subconscious mind as this, uh, sort of magical energy.

Einstein would say that energy is never created nor destroyed. It just flows into something else. So perhaps this consciousness, subconsciousness, or all variations is this web of energy passing from one person to another. And based on that, we could never answer yes or no absolute with any sort of real factual knowledge.

And that’s kind of the fun of it. On the other side of things though, when we look at measures of hypnotic depth, positive hallucination is one of them. And we are aware in all things hypnosis, especially any style of regression, past life or current life, or even future progression, there’s this natural tendency to follow the operator.

So is it confabulation? The answer really is we can’t give any one specific answer. We don’t have any evidence. That’s the, Okay. So on one side, so to back up the side for it to back up the side for personally, um, my feeling is I’m, You love the phrase that I’ve, uh, borrowed apathetic agnosticism, Eh, That’s okay.

Um, I’m, I think I’m more fascinated with how people’s belief systems are formed than I am with, with, with defining my own. I, I personally think it’s, I personally think it’s bullshit, but that’s me. Well, the phrase is, we’re all entitled to our belief systems, our opinions. Um, I, I’d reference that. Within anything that we do to form our specialty, my focus is change.

My focus is that personal transformation. So the one who would call me for past life regression, I’d ask the question of, what’s your goal of doing that? And I’d tell you that most of them over the years have said, Well, it’s because, um, well, I’m curious to which I would tell them my specialty has changed the same way that your dentist went to medical school and decided they wanna look at teeth the rest of their life.

So unfortunately, I can’t get excited about that process with you. I wouldn’t be a match. But here’s someone who I know. Um, When I get someone who calls and that’s what they want, and I find out a change process, this is where I may be shooting myself in the foot to go. Well understand what I do is typically what we call client-centered hypnosis, where I’m matching the right process at the right time to address your change.

So let me ask you a dangerous question. You and I work together, and let’s use the example recently that I had. You and I work together and you completely knock out the drinking and it’s no longer an issue. But as part of our process by way of what we call client-centered hypnosis, I’ve never found it necessary in the process with you and me specifically to make use of past life regression.

Will you still be a satisfied client? And if they can answer yes to that, come on in. Uh, my favorite though was this woman that I was doing hesitate to use the word, uh, standard age regression session with, um, and she was actually a, uh, Navy chaplain, Baptist preacher, that on her own spontaneously went into a past life regression without any sort of guidance for me.

And I just love the moment where she smiled at the end and just politely went well. That changes a few things. Um, I, I think I more fascinated with how the beliefs are formed. Um, I think I’ve told you the same thing before. I was raised with a family where half of them were Jewish, the other half were Southern Baptist.

The more I bring in my own personal experience into the conversation, the more it kind of throws things off. Um, no, but I’d say that any good hypnotist should be flexible within their style. Um, so specifically we were chatting about a, a protocol before that does have some past life regression moments.

If I have a person in front of me that, that’s not part of their belief system, it’s as if that segment never exists. Yeah. Don’t do that. When you work with me, do not do it. Cause I think it’s worth shit. Jason, I want to thank you for being my guest on this podcast, . It’s really been amazing. Well, it’s been amazing to be on here.

Why am I get, why am I editing this one? , people wanna get in touch with you. How did you do that? Uh, easy to find me. I’m at work smart hypnosis.com. There’s, uh, really great podcast sessions that come out every week. I think we’ve got a couple, maybe a three parter with Ross Jeffries coming up soon. Great.

And if people wanna get in touch with me, Ross Jeffries, to be on their podcast or speak to their group or at their event, go to Ross Jeffries. Live J e f f r i e s, ross jeffries live.com. And I have a free, uh, persuasion video training. Go to ross jeffries live.com/. Course that’s a forward slash I gotta let you go.

It’s been great speaking with you. This has been awesome. You’ve been a great guest. I really have to go talk soon, . All right, see you around. Bye. Jason. Lynette here, and thank you once again for listening to this program and it’s sessions like this one that are typically conversations you would not hear at any hypnosis convention, at any hypnosis meetup.

That’s what this work Smart hypnosis program is all about. It’s about these in-depth conversations that are all about challenging those things that far too many of us are just simply repeating what our instructors told us. So you heard that great example of where he’s calling me out and giving way too stock, way too easy of an answer and instead forcing into that trans derivational search to really look inside.

So with that passionately, I. Thank you for more like this in terms of how do you approach your hypnotic change work? How do you navigate within your client session in such a way that produces profound change and profound hypnotic phenomenon? I’d encourage you to head over to hypnotic workers.com rather than individually sourced programs and products on inductions and deepeners and techniques for change.

Instead, for a low investment of just $47, you can get started today getting full access to all of my hypnosis training content. Whether it’s real client sessions from the moment they walk in the door to the moment they walk out the door, whether it’s classroom demonstrations, work, shopping, session structure, I’d share that over the years, most of my classes are no longer the brand new hypnotists looking to learn and get certified.

Instead, the majority of my audience are perhaps people like you. You’ve been trained elsewhere. Maybe you’re a little too dependent on the written script. Maybe you feel a little stuck. Maybe you find yourself getting into places and you just don’t know what to do, and that’s what Hetic Workers is all about.

It’s about giving you the techniques, the tactics, to be a confident, competent, and really unstoppable in your hypnotic process to really navigate towards that better change. Check that out today. Get started for just $47 [email protected]. There’s a whole online community attached to it of practitioners from around the world working together to improve our profession.

I’ll see you on the inside. Thanks, Ross. Thanks for listening to the Work Smart Hypnosis Podcast and work smart hypnosis.com.